The Official Zebralight Thread .

AstroTurf

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ZL brings back a 14500 powered flashlight... for a limited time.

Check out their website, scroll to the bottom, an wahlah...

A SC52F L2, which can run 14500 batteries is on sale for 45 bucks.

w00 h00!!!

Jim

PS If I didn't already have one running 14500 on my desk, I would have bought them all!!!
 

AstroTurf

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PSS I just checked and it looks like they have 13 left.

ZL brings back a 14500 powered flashlight... for a limited time.

Check out their website, scroll to the bottom, an wahlah...

A SC52F L2, which can run 14500 batteries is on sale for 45 bucks.

w00 h00!!!

Jim

PS If I didn't already have one running 14500 on my desk, I would have bought them all!!!
 

chillinn

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Brought back... or clearing left over new old stock? Or building out left over old parts?

Product page claims runtimes are the same for 14500 and Eneloop "2000mAh" (which I did not know existed... I have only seen Eneloop 1900mAh and Eneloop Pro 2500mAh, and have only previously seen Zebralight test with Eneloop Pro). Assuming this model is old stock, they would have tested with their own Zebralight labeled 14500... which I can only assume were 750mAh at best. Which means... more runtime on newer Vapcell 1000mAh 14500 than on Eneloop (but which Eneloop... Standard or Pro? Is 2000mAh a typo? or a generalization? Or were previous generation standard Eneloops actually 2000mAh?)
 
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chillinn

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missed the point...

Yes... rather escapes me why everyone is crazy about Zebralight on 14500 when the modes are regulated, as in precisely the same mode brightness levels between NiMH or Li-ion, except for the top two modes. So you get 535Lm for one minute (difference between 300Lm and 285Lm probably negligible). Is that it? The point is having 535Lm for a whole endless minute? By all means, enlighten me.

Eneloop Pro still has way more energy than 14500. Though I am happy about the new 1000mAh Vapcell, it is still less impressive than Eneloop Pro.
 
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this_is_nascar

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I think the desire for 14500 support is the ability to use any and all AA type cells available.

For example, I can honestly say that both my Lumintop Tool AA and Ultratac A1 can and will safely run on any and all AA types cells that are available.

You can't say that with the SC53 series from ZL. That ability was lost because there was no code space left after ZL added the ability to customize G6 and G7 fully. They code only fit either the 14500 support or the customization support.

That's what read anyway.


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chillinn

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Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations, no matter how popular the 14500 get, and that popularity is waning since several makers figured out how to get 500Lm, or close to it, from Eneloops. The SC80, tho, I find compelling in that regard. Too bad those are gone.

The most impressive use for 14500, IMO, is hotrodding old incan single AA lights, or incan MagLites, or just plain non-Zebralight non-regulated 14500 LED lights, Coast, Pelican, Klarus, Fenix, Nitecore, etc. There are enough 14500/AA lights. The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.
 
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raggie33

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Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations, no matter how popular the 14500 get, and that popularity is waning since several makers figured out how to get 500Lm, or close to it, from Eneloops. The SC80, tho, I find compelling in that regard. Too bad those are gone. The most impressive use for 14500, IMO, is hotrodding old incan single AA lights, or incan MagLites,mor just plain non-Zebralight non-regulated 14500 lights, Coast, Pelican, Klarus, Fenix, Nitecore, etc. There are enough 14500/AA lights. The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.
have 16 eneloops comeing crazy the world we live in today i just ordered them today and they be here today
 

chillinn

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have 16 eneloops comeing crazy the world we live in today i just ordered them today and they be here today

That's some seriously fast shipping. Best I have seen is 3 days, which blew me away. I ordered 16 Ladda 2450 (Eneloop Pro) from IKEA 3 weeks and 3 days ago, no sign of them, but they're only 3 days late.
 
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skid00skid00

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"Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations,"

This is called "cherry picking". In an emergency situation, you'll be lucky to find *any* stock, with AA being sold out *first*.


"The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight."

At the time, Zebralight got ONLY 300 lumens out of AA, and 540 out of LiIon. Imagine what they could get out of LiIon NOW.

I'd love for people like you to rationally explain why they want *fewer* features in any specific item, when more features are available. Digital camera forums also have many outspoken posters, who decry the ability of a camera to do (OMGZ) VIDEO RECORDING!!! (Must be satan taking over those manufacturers! :D )
 

chillinn

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chillinn said:
Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations,

This is called "cherry picking". In an emergency situation, you'll be lucky to find *any* stock, with AA being sold out *first*.

This is called a misapplication of cherry picking while actually cherry picking a single case without support. Will they sell out? Who said anything about finding new stock in stores? AA are everywhere. You will find them brand new or half spent in myriad devices in your own home and if the emergency dire enough, abandoned homes, half spent at garbage dumps, and generally just lying around.


chillinn said:
"The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.

At the time, Zebralight got ONLY 300 lumens out of AA, and 540 out of LiIon. Imagine what they could get out of LiIon NOW.

I imagine short runtimes of 700Lm, or shorter runtimes of 1000Lm. I understand people love lumens. Personally, I fail to see where one can not make due with 500Lm, nor why they can't get another light if they can't.

I'd love for people like you to rationally explain why they want *fewer* features in any specific item, when more features are available. Digital camera forums also have many outspoken posters, who decry the ability of a camera to do (OMGZ) VIDEO RECORDING!!! (Must be satan taking over those manufacturers! :D )

Well, ad hominem argument notwithstanding, you're also begging the question aka petitio principii, or employing circular argument, and the camera argument is, btw, a straw man. Do I want fewer features? Is that my argument? I don't believe so. Running a chemistry that burdens the platform with nothing of value is not useful, thus not a feature, but instead superfluous. And otherwise, there is much to be said for avoiding feature creep.

Zebralight chose to maximize efficiency by designing the driver specifically around Eneloops. We don't know what sacrifice would be made to that efficiency by also supporting 14500, but we can assume the design is simpler to leave out 14500 support. Again, there are myriad competitors that do as you and others wish, support both chemistries, thus there is no compelling reason for Zebralight to do the same. And they already did, and one of those models is, for the moment, available. I would never stop you from purchasing it, and I am glad it is available to you.

I was never arguing that Zebralight should do this or not do that, only that I am perplexed a little by the insistence of support for both chemistries when the driver is regulated. If it wasn't regulated, and all the modes got brighter, then it would make sense to me.
 
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WalkIntoTheLight

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Zebralight chose to maximize efficiency by designing the driver specifically around Eneloops. We don't know what sacrifice would be made to that efficiency by also supporting 14500, but we can assume the design is simpler to leave out 14500 support.

Zebralight used to make AA lights that would work with both NiMH, alkaline, and lithium-ion 14500. I have a SC52 and SC52w light that does this. If I compare their Eneloop efficiency against a "Eneloop-only" light like my SC5w at moderate power, it's close. But, the SC5w is a more efficient light. However, the SC5w is also a newer light, so perhaps general improvements also have an effect on its better efficiency.

Note, the difference isn't huge. IIRC, it's somewhere around 10%. I think you get a better efficiency improvement just by going with a cool-white LED.
 

chillinn

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This is in no way accurate just my experience. I really think it comes down to the fact the 14500 are cool as hell, because we all grew up with friggin dry cell AA. Alkaline batteries have been around for some time, but I swear in the 1970's, heavy duty cells seemed to be the ubiquitous AA, and alkaline was expensive. Then it was a short day of being amazed at how much better alkaline were in the late 1970s and into the 1980s, until the issue with leaks happened so much they became hated. Then NiCad AA rechargeable gave us many recharges and low capacity. Then the HSD NiMH were revolutionary. Then I assume ICR14500 LiCo cells appeared, but only for the intrepid few that were in the know, slowly becoming more popular as the secret got out. LSD NiMH AA appeared within maybe half a decade of 14500. Eneloops are only about 10 years old. I am still quite taken by Eneloops, only really discovering them less than 3 years ago, and this after being blown away by IMR14500 LiMn about a year or two before that. With Eneloops, it was an issue of decent capacity and no longer needing to charge the thing just before I needed it; they sat ready.

Now at least one label has increased 14500 capacity to 1000mAh. I am still waiting for the 14500 INR stock to reappear, and this is just for my own purpose of a couple AA Malkov hosts with Elite heads and MN02, which I doubt would interest many that want the 14500 for lumens. I want some compact low level incan runtime, that's my bag.

I am ok with Zebralight AA lights being AA only. And I'm not preaching to exclude 14500 support, I'm not, I just care less because Eneloops need so much less care than 14500. It is my own fault for irresponsibly abusing and killing at least 7x AW IMR14500, and they are hard to kill compared to unprotected LiCo, and AW seems to be gone. When Zebralight did support 14500, the driver had low voltage cut off, which is just great... but I was into other lights when those were available, and when I did get the SC5w OP, it killed me, so I assume the earlier drivers had the same issue, and passed on the ZL 14500 opportunity. It was with caution and some trepidation that I finally tried the SC5c II. Success... it does not destroy me. Even now the SC52F L2 AA is available again for a short time, and at discount, I am too much of a coward to try it because I expect the same results as I had with SC5w OP, and because I think the Mk II platform is probably superior. idk, just a suspicion, and we all have our biases. Fear and/or bias is always irrational.

Funny thing, I have a suspicion that with Li-ion, the problem I had with SC5w OP isn't there, because the SC62c doesn't seem to kill me; I kept it. And I am giving the SC53c a shake, and I am optimistic. But I am probably done with the ZL drivers in the hosts that are shaped like the SC52, assuming because of what it looks like, the entire generation of those might cause me migraine.

I think few are bathing ourselves in the light as a room lamp for hours on end as WalkIntoTheLight and I do. They are using flashlights more ordinarily, with the lumens pointed away from them and not bouncing all over the place and into their eyes. They probably think were weird. I'm ok with that, too.
 
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this_is_nascar

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Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations, no matter how popular the 14500 get, and that popularity is waning since several makers figured out how to get 500Lm, or close to it, from Eneloops. The SC80, tho, I find compelling in that regard. Too bad those are gone.

The most impressive use for 14500, IMO, is hotrodding old incan single AA lights, or incan MagLites, or just plain non-Zebralight non-regulated 14500 LED lights, Coast, Pelican, Klarus, Fenix, Nitecore, etc. There are enough 14500/AA lights. The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.
I agree. I'm in the camp that prefers my ZLs just the way they are. I was just attempting to explan what I believe to be the case with those disappointed due to the lack of 14500 support.


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this_is_nascar

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That's some seriously fast shipping. Best I have seen is 3 days, which blew me away. I ordered 16 Ladda 2450 (Eneloop Pro) from IKEA 3 weeks and 3 days ago, no sign of them, but they're only 3 days late.
Is there just one variety of these Ladda cells from Ikea. I keep hearing about them and have an Ikea pretty close to me.


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chillinn

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I agree. I'm in the camp that prefers my ZLs just the way they are.

We are as one, this_is_nascar... we are as one.

Is there just one variety of these Ladda cells from Ikea. I keep hearing about them and have an Ikea pretty close to me.

Ostensibly, there are two. But the brown 900mAh Ladda are supposedly Chinese standard Eneloops. Only the Ladda 2450 are manufactured in Japan by FDK, and must be Eneloop Pro. So effectively, at ~$7 a quad, those are the only ones worth having.

Ever been to an IKEA? I went in one trying to find the Ladda. I wasted an hour looking around, and then another hour looking for an employee to ask before leaving disgusted. IKEA is an absurd place. You just kind of have to go in, see something you like, and get it, but there is no finding what you are looking for unless you already know where it is.
 
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this_is_nascar

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We are as one, this_is_nascar... we are as one.



Ostensibly, there are two. But the brown 900mAh Ladda are supposedly Chinese standard Eneloops. Only the Ladda 2450 are manufactured in Japan by FDK, and must be Eneloop Pro. So effectively, at ~$7 a quad, those are the only ones worth having.

Ever been to an IKEA? I went in one trying to find the Ladda. I wasted an hour looking around, and then another hour looking for an employee to ask before leaving disgusted. IKEA is an absurd place. You just kind of have to go in, see something you like, and get it, but there is no finding what you are looking for unless you already know where it is.
So, the 2450s are the ones I should get?


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chillinn

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yes

Bear in mind that Eneloop Pro promise 500 recharges compared to 2000+ recharges with standard Eneloops. IME, Eneloop Pro do not tolerate over discharge as well as Eneloop, which seem to recover better with less of a knock on capacity and amps, but even standard Eneloop, with enough instances of over discharge, become IMO unusable. So I have split the difference and stocked up on both branded standard Eneloop and IKEA Ladda 2450. Now I know more, I hope I can baby these. My original set of branded Eneloop Pro maybe lasted 4 months and 30 recharges. My own fault. I wasn't even resting them, but I think the many over discharges below 0.97V did it.

Also, if you order from IKEA, their estimated ship time is not exaggerated, and if anything, it is conservative. Three weeks for me was last Wednesday, and still no sign of them or any indication on their provided tracking function shows anything. About a week ago, IKEA sent a notice they were "picking" my order, but the tracking doesn't indicate that... indicates nothing but the order is in. I am patient, but this is getting ridiculous. And trying to contact IKEA to inquire will force the order to cancel. But the savings, I suppose, will make it all worth it, when they finally arrive.
 
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