The SureFire P2X-B "Fury" 500lu flashlight thread

[shramj]

Re: Will Surefire improve on the Fury P2X-B?

I'm trying to get a grip on what rechargables I can use in the Fury. I currently have the TL-100 to charge my 18650's for my other lights and I know I can't use the 18650 in the Fury. But has anyone used the Ultrafire rechargable 3.6V 880mAh 16340's in their Fury? I would like to use these Ultrafire 16340's because I can charge them with my TL-100 charged instead of having to buy a whole new charger kit. Also, I was also looking at the Tenergy RCR 3.0V 900mAh or the Tenergry 3.0V 750mAh LiFePO4 if I can't use the Ultrafire 16340 in it. Any input/suggestions would be great. If it matters, I prefer higher output than total runtime if helps with making a suggestion. I also was reading and it sounds like the *ltrafires aren't really that safe and they may explode so I don't really know where to go as far as rechargables go, any input would be great.

 

[lightphysics]

** Off-topic post deleted - Kestrel **

 

[Kestrel]

Hello lightphysics, welcome to CPF.

I have deleted your prior post, as it was nearly all off-topic for this "SureFire Fury" thread.
Please feel free to create a new thread in the appropriate subforum if you would like to further explore topics such as these in a more theoretical aspect.
I would also recommend doing more research on CPF for supplementary background knowledge on these or other topics - you will find that others here have vast hands-on experience with some of these topics and might find many of their posts to be instructive reading.

Best regards,


Edit: FWIW, RedForest UK also has posted an illustrative reply below, much of which is helpful as it deals with specifics of the SureFire Fury. I hope that some of the below might be of assistance? Either way, let's please stay on-topic for this "SureFire Fury" thread.

Thanks everyone,

 

[RedForest UK]

@lightphysics: I see no problems with what pjandyho posted. I can see you know your physics and are trying to apply it to flashlight/circuit applications but most of what you say is irrelevant to the immediate topic and doesn't add anything more than a conceptual background to why these things work (which is good to know but can confuse people just wanting to know the functional implications of this). Most of your posts appear to have a primary purpose of you trying to show off what you know rather than actually use and apply that knowledge in a helpful explanation to others.

The question about whether you can use RCR123s in the Fury is a simple one. It does not depend on the LED vf or what the XM-L can take as what the XM-L gets is entirely dictated by the circuit output. If the light was run direct drive then the input from 2x 3v CR123 primaries would fry an XM-L in a few seconds anyway, so clearly it uses a buck driver to output a lower voltage to the LED (one matching the LED vf), as with most good buck drivers the current output is also regulated to keep the overall wattage going to the LED at each light level consistent throughout the batteries' discharge.

So, we know the Fury uses a buck circuit (else it couldn't take 2x 3v cells). The only question we need to answer is what the max voltage input of this particular circuit is. Different buck circuits with different components can take different max input voltages, and as far as I know without disassembly of the light and examining the circuit the only way we can tell what the max input voltage is is by testing progressively higher voltages and measuring the current draw (or brightness which indirectly also measures watt output) to see if the circuit can maintain regulation.

This is an empirical test, I don't know exactly what you mean when you say that certain statements are 'unscientific' etc, but a large number of empirical results of whether the light maintains regulation at 8.4v (2x RCR Li-ion) is the closest to scientific justification we are going to get here I think unless someone wants to tear the light down and analyse the components themselves.

Pjandyho makes the good point however (using the L2 as an analogy) that while a circuit may apparently be able to take an input of 8.4v (this would be apparent by it maintaining regulation at 8.4v) it may still not have been designed to do so originally and so running higher voltage cells in it may degrade the circuit much faster than running it with something totalling under it's designed max input voltage.

This is clear already however to many in this thread who are now concerned primarily with working out what the max input voltage the P2X was designed for is, with Kestrel making the very good point that for surefire it may have been most pragmatic to use a circuit which could take > 9v input safely so they could use the Fury head on a 3 cell light later on.



EDIT: I see Kestrel has deleted the original post as off-topic anyway. I'm not sure whether my post is also OT as it was a response or whether it contains any information which may be judged useful for the thread anyway. Please do whatever you see fit with it.

 

[lightphysics]

That is in agreement with my observation that the light did not appear brighter on RCR123's ...and the primary benefit is cutting the need to buy an endless supply of primaries to run the light.

TEEJ,

Yes, its simple math to do a test, but you must know ahead of time that the circuit can take that voltage. After that, you measuring your watts will give you an idea which type of battery produces more light. The biggest mistake everyone makes is that they assume if you push more voltage, you will get more light. But if the flashlight regulates the current and hence gives less watts to the bulb, then less lumens.

 

[880arm]

Re: Will Surefire improve on the Fury P2X-B?

Thanks Robin24! I can't quite convince myself whether or not the traces are the same from the video. Can anyone else tell?

The traces in the 6PX and G2X are different than what is in the Fury. However, I compared a 6PX Pro to a G2X Tactical and I think I can see what appears to be a "cut trace" on the G2X Tactical.

In the photos below, take a look at the trace at approximately the 9:00 position. The first photo is from a 6PX Pro and the second photo is from a G2X Tactical.


6PX Pro - Note the undisturbed trace at the 9:00 position

G2X Tactical - The trace at 9:00 appears to be "factory" cut. It's hard to see in the photo but there is a very definite scratch perpendicular to the trace that's about 1/4" long.

This G2X is the only Tactical version I have. I would feel stronger about this if someone else could verify this cut trace appears on theirs as well.

 

[Justin Case]

[Post deleted.

 

[Toohotruk]

Re: Will Surefire improve on the Fury P2X-B?

...This G2X is the only Tactical version I have. I would feel stronger about this if someone else could verify this cut trace appears on theirs as well.

My G2X Tactical has the factory cut as well...very interesting!

 

[Justin Case]

Re: Will Surefire improve on the Fury P2X-B?

Post deleted.

 

[880arm]

Re: Will Surefire improve on the Fury P2X-B?

My G2X Tactical has the factory cut as well...very interesting!

Thanks for checking. That makes two!

Put some DMM probes on the Tactical to see if there is continuity across the trace. Presumably, you won't have continuity. Then bridge the trace with a wire and see if you get 6PX behavior.

I wanted to do that yesterday but I will have to leave that testing to someone who has gotten the head off of one of their 6PX/G2X Tactical lights.

 

[Sean]

Re: Will Surefire improve on the Fury P2X-B?

The traces in the 6PX and G2X are different than what is in the Fury. However, I compared a 6PX Pro to a G2X Tactical and I think I can see what appears to be a "cut trace" on the G2X Tactical.

In the photos below, take a look at the trace at approximately the 9:00 position. The first photo is from a 6PX Pro and the second photo is from a G2X Tactical.


6PX Pro - Note the undisturbed trace at the 9:00 position

G2X Tactical - The trace at 9:00 appears to be "factory" cut. It's hard to see in the photo but there is a very definite scratch perpendicular to the trace that's about 1/4" long.

This G2X is the only Tactical version I have. I would feel stronger about this if someone else could verify this cut trace appears on theirs as well.

I have a 6PX Tactical and the same trace on mine is cut. I tried to bridge the trace and it did make the light come on in low, but no amount of power cycling would get the light to switch modes from low to high while this trace was bridged. I wounder if there is something else missing from the tactical version (i.e. some electronic components) besides the cut trace to make it a two stage light?

 

[happyguy82]

Hi All,

I'm trying to find out which specific CREE XM-L LED the Fury uses. Is it the T-6 or U-2 or something else?

I'm sure it's been mentioned somewhere but I just can't find it at the moment.

Thanks.

 

[aalite]

Does the Fury use PWM on low mode like the Jetbeam BC40 or is it current controlled?

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Does the Fury use PWM on low mode like the Jetbeam BC40 or is it current controlled?

It's current controlled.

 

[aalite]

It's current controlled.

That's good to hear. Looks like I'll be getting one soon. Thanks.

 

[TEEJ]

TEEJ,

Yes, its simple math to do a test, but you must know ahead of time that the circuit can take that voltage. After that, you measuring your watts will give you an idea which type of battery produces more light. The biggest mistake everyone makes is that they assume if you push more voltage, you will get more light. But if the flashlight regulates the current and hence gives less watts to the bulb, then less lumens.

Your post is forgetting that we already know that we don't get more light from high voltage, and that the light is current controlled, and, that it doesn't HAVE a bulb.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

That's good to hear. Looks like I'll be getting one soon. Thanks.

You're going to love it! Solid build quality and a beautiful beam that is a nice combination of flood and throw. Makes a great utility light, especially for outdoor use.

 

[cland72]

You're going to love it! Solid build quality and a beautiful beam that is a nice combination of flood and throw. Makes a great utility light, especially for outdoor use.

Agreed. I got mine late last week and used it on a walk after dark to light a path on low, then bumped it to high and it lit up everything within 100 yards easily.

 

[happyguy82]

You're going to love it! Solid build quality and a beautiful beam that is a nice combination of flood and throw. Makes a great utility light, especially for outdoor use.

I strongly agree too. I took a utility knife to one of the units and tried to scratch off the anodised coating and I even tried to scratch the glass window but all my efforts were futile.

 

[happyguy82]

Hi guys,

So I ran this flashlight on High for circa 15 - 20 mins yesterday while leaving it lying horizontally on a wooden table. I did this because I used it as a source of illumination for something that I was doing.

When I grabbed the unit to shut the light off, the body was very hot. It was too hot to hold for more than a couple of seconds in my bare hands.

Is this normal and would it shorten the LED's life?

Thanks.