Coronavirus - II

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Thanks fixer for the chart. I took a picture of it to show wife later.

Our (actually she is) capable boss ordered masks with our logo on the front of it. It is decent: adjustable ear tension, almost pointy protuberant area where the nose goes, cotton inside and poly/spandex outside (hopefully electrostatic effect). Inside the clear wrap containing the mask was a card making it clear that the mask is not PPE. "The decision to use this mask is solely your own" underlined at the bottom of the card. Then a sewn-in tag inside the mask, describing it to be China made, with washing instructions and materials used; "WARNING: Not intended to prevent or eliminate exposure to any disease, infection, or communicable disease". Strange Days Indeed.


If it doesn't have a filter pocket (preferably open on both ends) where you can insert a disposable PM2.5 filter, don't bother. The filter is the thing. The reason masks can be made from breathable cotton is so folks can breath easier with such a mask, but more important.... to hold filter material in place in a secure way and consistent manner.
 
If it doesn't have a filter pocket (preferably open on both ends) where you can insert a disposable PM2.5 filter, don't bother. The filter is the thing. The reason masks can be made from breathable cotton is so folks can breath easier with such a mask, but more important.... to hold filter material in place in a secure way and consistent manner.

Indeed. I bought a couple of cotton washable masks with filter pockets. If I hold the mask up to a light I can see plenty of light passing through the fabric. The gaps in the fabric that pass light can also pass viral particles. If I hold the mask's PM2.5 filter up to the light, nothing passes through it directly.
 
The light blue/green type?
The kind dentists wore before covid-19.

They were going for $2 each in my area when you could find them back in April. Now a box of 50 is around $4. They're pretty comfy to breath through for me. And they mostly stay put when you talk. That's about 90% of what I see folks wearing in my area anymore. I hardly see anymore "fashion" numbers or Nike swoop kind. I'm also noticing bandanas are making a comeback. Plain color like solid blue or gray. I was the only person in the store with a "fun mask" on. Mine today was a dental number with "covid-19 sucks" written on it.

Our grocery store was fully stocked this week. Even Lysol and Clorox wipes were plentiful. I noticed several peoples baskets were stocked with dry cereal like Apple Jacks and Raisin Bran. Trouble on the horizon or just coincidence? Perhaps it was stocking up for hurricane season? ………
 
<SNIP>

Our grocery store was fully stocked this week. Even Lysol and Clorox wipes were plentiful. I noticed several peoples baskets were stocked with dry cereal like Apple Jacks and Raisin Bran. Trouble on the horizon or just coincidence? Perhaps it was stocking up for hurricane season? ………
In case there is trouble on the horizon, in part because after Labor Day school will start with many kids probably cross contaminating, and a month later the regular flu season will start.

The prepper in me bought a small 5 cu ft freezer, and a generator. 7 cu ft freezers were not available within 100 miles.
This week I plan to go shopping and to stock up on those items that became unobtainable when people started hording.
In particular I need to get a supply of "California Pizza Kitchen" frozen pizza. No other brand will do for those with an eating disorder.
Penne pasta, and Classico vodka sauce. Other brands were sometimes available, but wouldn't get eaten in my house.

At least now we have a better idea what to buy, and not to waste our money on.
 
Define irony. :laughing:

...

The prepper in me bought a small 5 cu ft freezer, and a generator. 7 cu ft freezers were not available within 100 miles.
This week I plan to go shopping and to stock up on those items that became unobtainable when people started hording.

...

At least now we have a better idea what to [hoard], and not to waste our money on.

:nana:
 
All of the paper masks I've seen lately have three layers, which is good. The outer layers are paper and the inner layer is that "meltblown" material. Some of these masks have a thicker center layer than others.
yea 3 layers on my mask i even took one apart to check .as i said b4 i wore a mask since early march
 
I don't want to start a panic or argument. By now, everyone should know what the cloth layered masks are for... protecting others from you, not visa versa. You are protected by keeping your hands clean, not touching your face, and keeping your distance from everyone. Bearing in mind your mask is for everyone else, new studies have shown that wearing these masks, I mean surgical masks, bandannas, and all the new designer masks, do somewhat reduce the risk of your own infection. But even the N95 surgical masks were not designed to protect the wearer, but prevent the wearer from infecting a vulnerable patient in a critical environment.

If you are not infected, or have been infected and have fully recovered, there are masks that protect the wearer, if you can find them. Back in February and previously, they could be found in any hardware store or paint store in North America with suitable filters for about $12-$16. By March, gone gone gone. Even major suppliers were out of stock. I mean a half face reusable respirator with P95 or P100 organic HEPA filters. The HEPA filters are quite amazing, and virus is an easy target for these 3M filters, even though the virus is actually smaller than the filters' ratings of 3nm, smaller particles still won't get through. You could be on a ward of 50 infected coughing on you and if you wear eye protection, not be infected. In fact, you will see some medical personnel in such environments wearing the far more expensive medical Air Purifying Respirators (APR), which start at about $200, but they are basically the same, function the same, as the 3M 6200 (6300 for big faces, 6100 for children)... though some of the medical APRs have little motors and fans in them.

The caveat is these masks do not protect others from you, there is no filtering when you exhale, so if you wear them, do not be infected, know for certain that you are not infected. 3M respirators and the P95 or P100 organic filters can be found domestically on eBay, but there is a lot of price gouging, and some only apparent price gouging, mostly due to residential sellers getting them from major suppliers, and FedEx, UPS. et. al jacking shipping prices to residences.

The non-USPS shippers are really outdoing themselves in sucking. USPS is a good model of what shipping prices should be to any residence. I think other shippers need to be federally investigated on their insane pricing schemes. Tiny box going to a residence, $18-$25, while USPS might charge $8 or less depending on weight.

Anyway, remain uninfected CPFers. All you need do is keep your hands clean, do not touch your face, and keep your distance from everyone, and you can escape this without illness, filtering respirator or not.

Edit: Kids, btw, are walking Petri dishes. They have to be. That is how we build resistance to infection as children. If you have kids, carry wipes, and hand sanitizer, and use generously.
 
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Comorbidities

Table 3 shows the types of health conditions and contributing causes mentioned in conjunction with deaths involving coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). For 6% of the deaths, COVID-19 was the only cause mentioned. For deaths with conditions or causes in addition to COVID-19, on average, there were 2.6 additional conditions or causes per death. The number of deaths with each condition or cause is shown for all deaths and by age groups. For data on comorbidities, Click here to download.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/...dbTrmKwH1NdaBx6PpZo2kxotNwkUXlnbZXCwSRP2OmqsI

 
This guy at work wears a face shield. Looks like it doesn't almost nothing. At an angle, only 1" below chin. Trying to get around the mask rule I guess.
 
Face shields is a legitimate thing. Some schools are using them along with truck drivers and others, it just did not catch on like so-called masks for a few reasons. But for lip reading they work well along with seeing peoples facial expression.

If you notice most wear disposable masks now. At about 15 cents each (now) versus a $3 plastic face shield……

It's kinda like betamax versus vhs. VHS won.
 
This guy at work wears a face shield. Looks like it doesn't almost nothing. At an angle, only 1" below chin. Trying to get around the mask rule I guess.

Some people wear face shields because they have health issues with a mask like Asthma and other breathing issues. I think in some ways a face shield is more protection than a mask... in others less protection.
 
Face shields serve the same purpose as the cloth masks, to protect others from you, and they do offer some protection from a full frontal assault of another's sneeze or cough, but a mask can not protect you completely unless it seals air tight and actually filters virus. Just use what's available. Coronavirus technically is not airborne, but can hang in the air indoors for minutes after someone coughs or sneezes, and walking through an unseen cloud of infected moisture droplets could infect you. But the most common infection vector, by far, is from infected surfaces, touching an infected surface, then touching your eyes or nose. This is how it spreads so fast, and not as much from walking through clouds of someone's sneeze or cough. Being sneezed on and coughed on probably infected a number of people also, but not nearly as much as people infecting themselves with their own fingers. Tie your arms down if you have to, but don't touch your face.
 
chillinn, do you have documentation/published-research on your information?

The Clear Mask I spoke of in the mask thread brought some concern at work so I stopped using it. My opinion: the Clear Mask is probably more effective against spraying micro droplets and spittle on others than masks with exhaust ports or thin scarves and such. But it's all essentially half measures between 'no mask use' and 'everybody go home and stay there from now on until the miraculous vaccine saves us all'

Having worked 20+ years with special ed and kinder students, there is no doubt to me that my body is strong and prepared, and won't go bat scat doofus over-reacting to Coronavirus.
 
I heard on noon news China has No new cases of virus, and all schools are open this Fall

Wtf! Does the Chinese government know something we don't, ..or is this more fake news?

Kitro, after 20 yrs of snot noses you must have an iron clad immune system!
 
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chillinn, do you have documentation/published-research on your information?

Mechanical filter, this explains nicely about how a HEPA filter, rated to 3nm, will filter nearly all airborne particles, 99.97% of particles down to 3nm, and even a larger percentage of those far smaller than 3nm. (idk where the mu is on my iPad, so I have been using nm to mean "micrometers," sorry for any confusion with nanometers)

Wikipedia said:
HEPA filter are all filters meeting certain efficiency standards. A HEPA filter must remove at least 99.97% (US) or 99.95% (EU) of all airborne particulates with aerodynamic diameter of 0.3 μm. Particles both smaller and larger are easier to catch, and thus removed with a higher efficiency.

Wikipedia said:
The SARS-CoV-2 virus is a large pleomorphic spherical particle with bulbous surface projections. The average diameter of the virus particles is around 0.12 μm. The diameter of the envelope is 0.08 μm and the spikes are 0.02 μm long.

Micrometers (μm) are one millionth of a meter (m), or one thousandth of a millimeter (mm). To give you an idea of how small micrometers are...

Between 1 μm and 10 μm:
1–10 μm – length of a typical bacterium
10 μm – Size of fungal hyphae
5 μm – length of a typical human spermatozoon's head
3–8 μm – width of strand of spider web silk
about 10 μm – size of a fog, mist, or cloud water droplet

Between 10 μm and 100 μm:
about 10–12 μm – thickness of plastic wrap (cling wrap)
10 to 55 μm – diameter of wool fibre (not a thread, which is made of many fibres)
17 to 181 μm – diameter of human hair
70 to 180 μm – thickness of paper


Regarding 3M filters:

"certain organic vapors"

3M model (6001, 6003, 6004, 6005, 6006, 6009, 60921, 60923, 60926, 60925, 60928) filters are rated for "certain organic vapors," and include charcoal filtering; when they are paired with the P100 or P95 prefilter and prefilter retainer as a combination filter/cartridge, offer organic filtering superior to filters listed below only rated for

"nuisance level organic vapor relief,"

P100, round or disk shaped, pink, magenta or grey, 3M model (2091-07000, 2097 or 07184, 2291, 2297, 7093C or 37173) filters are rated for "nuisance level organic vapor relief, " and nuisance levels refer to concentrations below the OSHA PEL or other government standard, whichever is lower.

But with either set up (including 3M P95 filters), all virus is an easy target for them, according to the 3M filter expert I spoke with. I had to wait on hold nearly 2 hours, but he set my mind at ease.

(Apparently, the reason 3M personal protective equipment (PPE) is difficult to get a hold of now when once (like in early February 2020) so ubiquitous, my understanding at least, is the federal government bought up all stock everywhere and are hoarding it. By now, the feds have enough respirators to equip every man, woman and child physically within the borders of the US a few times over. I don't know how true that is, sounds a bit like a whacky conspiracy.)

The N95 medical masks are a different animal. They must be fit tested to seal against the face. A 3M (6000, 7000, 8000, & 9000 series) or Honeywell (with their own filters I am not familiar with) reusable respirator seals air tight against the face, and matched with proper organic filters, will certainly be protective (but won't protect others around you from you).


Regarding naked individual virus being able to go through even a layered cloth mask like it isn't there... this is my own conjecture, based on my powers of deduction. The finest, tightest weave made of spider silk would not be able to prevent virus from going through it, because a virus is about 100x smaller than any weave possibly could be.

A plain weave (the tightest and simplest of all weaves) of 0.3mm diameter Kevlar fibers wrapped to about 10 times that size, or 3mm, is about as tight a weave as practical. Coronavirus is 2500 times smaller than the diameter of Kevlar fiber, and at least 250 times smaller than the smallest gaps between its plain weave threads.

Internet search the news regarding newest studies about the cloth masks (here's what's at CDC),
because these ordinary cloth masks, even cheesy ones, regardless of the obvious, help immensely to prevent infection for the wearer, because while the point of them is to stop your droplets, which may be filled with virus and large enough to be trapped in a cloth weave, they do end up also stopping the droplets coming at you. Coronavirus is not airborne, and it can only hang for a short time in the air in these far larger droplets that are sneezed and coughed out.

Protecting the eyes is just as important in public as protecting the nose and mouth, prescription glasses and sunglasses will do, as well as safety glasses.

Contact wearers should have stopped wearing their contacts, at all, months ago. Don't wear contacts until the pandemic has abated.

The main infection vector is your own fingers, IMO. Keep those clean, and don't touch your face, keep back from others, and you won't be infected, mask or not.

Note: CDC disagrees with me (and I am terrible at biology, but I can read and generally my logic is bulletproof)
COVID-19 is primarily transmitted from person-to-person through respiratory droplets. These droplets are released when someone with COVID-19 sneezes, coughs, or talks. Infectious droplets can land in the mouths or noses of people who are nearby or possibly be inhaled into the lungs.

CDC says being sneezed and coughed on is the main infection vector. I just don't buy it. Yes, that will infect you. How often are the sick coughing and sneezing on the uninfected? I think, I really believe, the only way this could spread so fast is we do it to ourselves: someone sneezes, the infected water droplets hang briefly, maybe as long as 15 minutes to an hour depending on environmental circulation systems, but ultimately they land on surfaces, and Coronavirus can exist there for days, depending on what that surface is (not on copper or silver, or any other oligodynamic metal, like brass), we come along later, lean against this surface, touch it, then rub our eyes. I think it takes 2 instances of a single virus to be infected, and that can happen with a single nose rub. Don't touch your face.
 
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I heard on noon news China has No new cases of virus, and all schools are open this Fall

Wtf! Does the Chinese government know something we don't, ..or is this more fake news?

Back in July China said they had tested 90 million people and had like 36 new cases in the month.
Dictator government distorting facts? Say it aint so.
 
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