Kudos to Fenix on the L0D Q4 holiday special edition light

[flashy bazook]

at least on specs (do not have the L0D Q4 - yet!), it seems to match the Rebel 100 special japanese store for most precious customers who only like green tea edition.

the main "disadvantage" is that the Q4 only comes in red. So far. I am convinced by luminescent's analysis that moving to the Q5 would not bring any large benefits with the current emitter.

Anyways, we are arguing over small differences by now, the L0D Q4 (or Rebel 100, if you could get it) seems to be in a class by itself. Having one of those on your keychain would seem to be a no-brainer, if you can get one whose looks you like--or at least do not find offensive!

 

[todo]

Question. I have an original LODCE that has hundreds of 10440 battery cycles run thru it with no problems ever, its nearly a year old. I just got a new red LOD Q4. The Q4 on a 10440 is noticably brighter than my old LODCE on a 10440, it not a big difference but its obvious. Now is this what others are experiencing??? or is my old LOD suffering from diminishing lumins prob due to the 10440's???.

 

[f22shift]

does any place sell a rebel 100 led? i dont see it anywhere

 

[shakeylegs]

does any place sell a rebel 100 led? i dont see it anywhere

I saw some on future this am. Says to call.

 

[WadeF]

Question. I have an original LODCE that has hundreds of 10440 battery cycles run thru it with no problems ever, its nearly a year old. I just got a new red LOD Q4. The Q4 on a 10440 is noticably brighter than my old LODCE on a 10440, it not a big difference but its obvious. Now is this what others are experiencing??? or is my old LOD suffering from diminishing lumins prob due to the 10440's???.

Shouldn't a Cree Q4 be noticeably brighter than a Cree P4? The Q4 should be brighter because the Cree Q4 has more output than the Cree P4 in your original LOD-CE.

 

[flashy bazook]

OK, one correction - Lumapower is just putting out its Avenger 1xAAA EDC light which seems directed at the L0D formfactor (I say "seems" since I haven't yet seen the size specs).

It has the Rebel 100. So, if that's a strong consideration, Fenix may have some real competition here at last.

(I just posted a few more thoughts on this comparison in the "avenger" thread just started, if anyone is interested).

 

[Luminescent]

Shouldn't a Cree Q4 be noticeably brighter than a Cree P4? The Q4 should be brighter because the Cree Q4 has more output than the Cree P4 in your original LOD-CE.

With normal batteries the original L0D-CE with a standard P4 was rated at 50 lumens on high, where the new L0D-Q4 is rated at 75 (one and half times higher output :thumbsup.

Aside from this natural increase due to the Q4's improved output, there is another factor at work with 10440 cells that needs to be taken into account. As I mentioned in a previous post in this thread, the Vf of the emitters is always a crapshoot, and and has been getting lower. If you got a lower Vf emitter in your new Q4 it will draw more current on 10440's which could also account for some additional brightness. You can easily check for this higher current situation by seeing which light gets hottest the fastest. The light that gets hotter faster, is drawing more current.

You can eliminate this variable quite easily. The L0D has very good current regulation when used with the batteries it was designed for, so to eliminate this Vf based difference, run both lights on identical NiMH cells or fresh alkaline batteries.

This should restore a precise 50% increase in brightness, which should be noticeable but not super super dramatic. If after the change to standard batteries, your new Q4 light is REALLY BRIGHT compared to your older light, then you may well have partially cooked the emitter. To be sure, you can check with a light meter because a 50% increase in brightness is less than one EV unit (one f-stop), so if you are seeing close to a full EV or 1 f-stop (or more) difference then that's a sure indication that you have lost some output on your older light.

You may have seen the recent thread from someone that had a couple lights in a row get dim after running them several months on RCR123's. Obviously since they were running RCR123s, these lights weren't L0D's but RCR123s were pushing this guys lights harder, just like 10440s do in the L0D (in fact the 10440 hits the L0D a lot worse).

So I don't think there is any doubt that long term, the 10440 can indeed nuke your lumens on a L0D (depending on how hot it gets and how many hours it is run), but some folks figure it's worth the price for the extra output.

In any case, I would definitely do the heat comparison check I mentioned and make sure your new L0D-Q4 is not getting too-hot too-fast, because if it is, that's a sure sigh that you are probably in danger of cooking the Q4 emitter (and are also at a higher risk of an outright failure due to high current popping something else in the light's circuitry).

 

[frankr]

Who makes the best 10440's, and any idea how the run times between the different brands compare on the the LOB

 

[Luminescent]

OK, one correction - Lumapower is just putting out its Avenger 1xAAA EDC light which seems directed at the L0D formfactor (I say "seems" since I haven't yet seen the size specs).

It has the Rebel 100. So, if that's a strong consideration, Fenix may have some real competition here at last.

(I just posted a few more thoughts on this comparison in the "avenger" thread just started, if anyone is interested).

Found the Lumapower avenger thread –

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=171917

Intriguing looking little light; Rebel 100; textured reflector; clicky switch; but it's still not quite what the L0D would be with a Q4 or Rebel 100.

First, from the current drive levels they are quoting, it won't be anywhere near as bright as the L0D Q4 or L0D-RB100 (it just doesn't have enough drive).

Second the Avenger seems to use Lumapower's unique 2 level clicky interface. Though I am sure this will send Lumapower fans into raptures of ecstasy, I have never personally liked the way the lumapower lights go directly from super bright right to dim-dim-dim in a single jump (it's always seemed to me that there was a hole in the middle somewhere).

Third I predict that, like the LF2, the 'Avenger' is going to be panned by L0D/10440 fans, who are used to being able to blast the crap out of their light with more than five times the current drive that the manufacture designed it for, because Avenger is only quoting 270ma of drive on 10440 cells at 3.7 volts (which will only put it on a par with what the L0D can manage on NiMH cells, and far below what the L0D typically does on 10440).

Lastly, it's a little longer than the L0D. Though I am certain that the clicky switch in a longer profile light will be popular with some (look at all the posts in this thread), I personally kind of like the more compact and more reliable twisty switch form factor of the L0D.

The specs on the Avenger still seem to be preliminary, so it may improve, but even it it doesn't, the intoduction of this light IS a big deal because it will forever eliminate Fenix's option of going with anything less than a Q4 or R100 emitter in future L0D's if they want the light to remain competitive, and I think that's just great.

So Way to Go Lumapower !!! :twothumbs
I'm still waiting to see my L0D-R100 though.

 

[Bearcat]

Thankfully, the Fenix LOD Q4 has a SOS and Flash mode and the Lumapower Avenger doesn't have a medium mode, so I can hold on to my money a little longer.

Nice lights, but they are not quite right for me. When they quit making toys and make something useful for my key-chain, they will part me of my money and replace my EO on my keychain.

Look what Arc did with simple, easy and dependable in its day.

 

[garence]

Never got into the Dexlights, since they are clones of older Jetbeam models that have since been improved.

Also, I never warmed up to the complicated UI on either the Dexlight or Jetbeam higher end X1 lights and preferred the little Jetbeam C-LE v1.2 because it seemed to offer a better blend of simplicity vs. capability.
..[edited]..

Thanks -- you make a very good case to ditch the idea of getting an X.1 Dexlight. Plus, with the discount Fenix is running, it's cheaper--less money and superior circuitry sounds like a winning choice to me. :thumbsup:

 

[steelagman]

Was going through Lighthound yesterday and noticed they have an AAA Tiablo listed with a Rebel 100. Claims 100 lumens on high. ~$41. So there is competietion, which is good.

I got the Red LOD Q4 also and am very happy with it. For close up (e.g., walking around dark house) its just as bright as any of my singe AA lights (it doesn't have as much throw in the backyard test, but no surprise since small refelector is limiting).

 

[Luminescent]

Thankfully, the Fenix LOD Q4 has a SOS and Flash mode and the Lumapower Avenger doesn't have a medium mode, so I can hold on to my money a little longer.

Nice lights, but they are not quite right for me. When they quit making toys and make something useful for my key-chain, they will part me of my money and replace my EO on my keychain.

Look what Arc did with simple, easy and dependable in its day.

I take it from your post that, like quite a few others here on CPF, you don't have much use for STROBE and SOS modes on mult-mode lights like the L0D.

I can understand your concern about this if your previous experience was with a light like the Jetbeam C-LE, or many of DX multi-mode lights which have 'mode memory', because on these lights in order to cycle back to MEDIUM or LOW from HIGH you must first cycle through STROBE, and SOS every time. This is the price you pay on a light with memory for being able to start the light right up in any mode and return to it by default every time you turn the light on.

But this is NOT how the L0D-Q4 or any other L0D series light works.

I think most will find that their objection to these unwanted modes is offset somewhat by the fact that the L0D lacks mode memory.

Because it lacks mode memory, an L0D light will always start in MEDIUM and then cycle to LOW and then HIGH.

Sure STROBE and SOS are also available, but they always fall at the very end of the sequence so you won't even notice that they are there unless you need them. When you turn the light off for more than a couple seconds the sequence resets and the light will always start up in MEDIUM again.

This means that you can get to all three power levels every time you turn the light on and NEVER be bugged by having to cycle through STROBE or SOS under normal circumstances.

You might have to bump through them in a couple tenths of a second to wrap things back around if you miss a mode as you are trying to hit high, but I have found the mode switching on my L0D is pretty solid and this hasn't happened to me even 1 time in 50.

So yes the L0D does have STROBE and SOS but most of the time you don't even know that they are there.

Under these circumstances I don't find the STROBE and SOS modes even a little bit bothersome, and in any case I don't share your low opinion of them. In an emergency situation, not only does the fast strobe mode more than double the run time compared to the normal high mode, but it will also do one hell of a good job in helping someone pick you out from other natural light sources at a distance. For example if you are ever in a natural disaster like Katrina, a wilderness mishap, or a boating accident, and need to get yourself or someone else lifted out by medivac copter, you can use the STROBE mode to pinpoint your location after making an emergency call by radio or cell phone and telling them to relay to the pilot that you will be signaling with a white flashlight with a fast strobe sequence. Don't worry the L0D-Q4 can be seen for miles if you point it straight at someone. How will you know where to point it? No problem, you can spot the copter because it will have a STROBE (the question is will you have one as well, so the pilot can spot you?).

 

[BentHeadTX]

I used strobe mode last night. Two cars went to a hockey game and we were split up but I spotted the other car. Switched the L0D Q4 to strobe and pointed it in their direction and they turned towards me quickly. The comment was "figured you were the only one in town to have a strobe so it had to be you" Yes, it was me and our crew got back together.

Last week I was riding to work on my bicycle as usual and my helmet light was going quickly dim as the batteries were depleting. Tapped the L2D RB100 helmet light once and switched to strobe. It kept strobing for 20 minutes as I completed my journey in the darkness. The strobe function allows me to make it there on low battery power and be noticeable or used during the day in heavy traffic.

As a bicycle light or keychain light, I like strobe and use it here and there. No complaints.

 

[Luminescent]

Was going through Lighthound yesterday and noticed they have an AAA Tiablo listed with a Rebel 100. Claims 100 lumens on high. ~$41. So there is competietion, which is good.

I would go slowly on the Tiablo A1 until we see a good independent review posted on CPF.

First it's only a single mode light, which I am not really that interested in (especially if it's a battery hog). There are already a couple less expensive single-mode AAA lights in this power range including the Ultrafire 602 SSC U-Bin, and the Kaidomain AAA 'buckle light' (which also specs a SSC U-bin emitter)

Also the specifications for the light sound like they have been padded.

The specified output and runtime for the light is:

* Run Time: 110 Lumens, 80 minutes to 50% output

Gee, that certainly sounds nice! The only problem is that this claimed performance violates the laws of Physics. You can't get that much light, for that much time, with a Rebel 100 emitter, even if we assume the highest capacity AAA battery made, and 100% efficiency on the driver circuit.

I got the Red LOD Q4 also and am very happy with it. For close up (e.g., walking around dark house) its just as bright as any of my singe AA lights (it doesn't have as much throw in the backyard test, but no surprise since small refelector is limiting).

The throw is indeed a little less due to the floodier beam from the smaller reflector. To see how it really stacks up try a ceiling bounce test. When I do this, my L0D keeps up with almost all my 1 AA CREE lights (and blows away the 1W Luxeons).

I don't mind the slightly floodier beam at all, in fact I think it's just about perfect for the kinds of jobs you usually need your EDC light for.

 

[LightInTheWallet]

Still waiting for mine, (ordered one week ago) Darn postal service. Haven't bought a "quality" light since my EL "Little Friend" seoul. Maybe I will go down to the local Lowes and check out the Surefires. ( NOT going to Buy Both, though it is too close to the holidays for that.) is anyone else out there waiting impatiently for their LODQ4? Thanks for letting me get that off my chest, not many flashoholics in my circle of friends/ family/ co-workers.

 

[Wolf]

Still waiting for mine, (ordered one week ago) Darn postal service. Haven't bought a "quality" light since my EL "Little Friend" seoul. Maybe I will go down to the local Lowes and check out the Surefires. ( NOT going to Buy Both, though it is too close to the holidays for that.) is anyone else out there waiting impatiently for their LODQ4? Thanks for letting me get that off my chest, not many flashoholics in my circle of friends/ family/ co-workers.

You are not alone waiting on the postal service, I ordered a lodq4 that was shipped thurs from feinx-store at the same time as a order from lighthound, dunno how but the lighthound order showed up sat to my surprise, still waiting on the q4 to show up tho. Cant wait to play with the thing seeing the last good light I bought was a e2e surefire about 7 years ago (not counting the mag 3aaa led or the niteize 1watt kit I have, dunno if those count as good lol)

 

[Luminescent]

Maybe I will go down to the local Lowes and check out the Surefires. ( NOT going to Buy Both, though it is too close to the holidays for that.) is anyone else out there waiting impatiently for their LODQ4? Thanks for letting me get that off my chest, not many flashoholics in my circle of friends/ family/ co-workers.

For the best 'out of box experience' have some Energizer L92 Lithium E2's on hand (or at least some freshly charged NiMH batteries). The L0D-Q4 is ok on plain old Alkalines but it was designed to really shine on NiMH or L92 Lithium cells. (some of course like the insanely bright 10440 cells but that puts a lot of stress on the light so I don't recommend them)

I would definitely hold off on the Surefires till you get your L0D-Q4, so you can check out your Fenix performance before investing in another Surefire.

Personally, after my experience with Surefire and having seen how my Jetbeam and Fenix lights perform, I plan on holding off on Surefire forever.

Sad to say, the only light that has ever let me down in a critical situation was a Surefire.

That's really funny, because I just went to their web site and Surefire has a big snazzy banner ad with a caver lighting up a big underground cavern with a what I'm sure we are supposed to think is a Surefire flashlight (That's magically putting out more Lumens than an HID car headlight), with the text -

"If a work of art 100 Million years in the making takes your breath away, you should see what happens when you light quits."

Well they got at least one thing right, my Surefire light didn't 'quit', it just wouldn't turn on in the first place, when I desperately needed it to (due to one of Surefire's patented tailcap issues). Oh, and I wasn't in a cave, just on a very dark lonely stretch of road, on a very cold drizzly night, trying to get a damn blown-out tire changed. It was an old incan Surefire, that I got used, but it was immaculate when I got it and worked fine until I left it in the car for a few months. When I got home I found that the batteries were fine, and after much fiddling the light started working but I never trusted it again and gave it away to a friend in law enforcement with the advise that he should make Surefire replace the switch. Fortunately, on the night of my Surefire disaster, I remembered an old Dorcy light that I had stuffed under the seat when the Surefire took it's place of honor in my glove compartment. That twenty dollar Dorcy light from Target was scratched, dirty, and the batteries were 3 years old, but it worked perfectly and put out enough light that the several cars that came screaming around the turn were able to see me in time and swing wide enough to miss me on the narrow shoulder. If I had had to try to do the job in the dark, there is not a doubt in my mind I would probably be as dead now as my Surefire light was that night.

The Surefire G2L doesn't look too bad if you don't mind paying 65 bucks for a mostly plastic flashlight, but even if Surefire has cleaned up their act on the tail switch issues, this light uses a pair of CR123 batteries. I have personally seen CR123 cells vent in one of my lights (and NO I wasn't using cheapy batteries or mixing cells or any of the eighteen other silly rationalizations that CR123 groupies use to excuse totally unacceptable safety issues).

So between my past experience with Surefire, and the safety issues with CR123 cells, I will NOT be buying any Surefire lights in the near future.

Duracell plays the same B.S. game as Surefire with their ads, showing Firefighters and others with the tag line "If you life depends on your battery". Yeah, right, that's another laugh! I remember one time that I was just about to get in the car and take a brand new 2AAA River-Rock flashlight back to Target, when I decided (just for the hell of it) to check the brand new Duracell batteries that came with it first. It worked for about 20 minutes, suddenly quit and got a little warm. Well, surprise, surprise, of the two Duracell's that came with the light, one was ZERO volts (it had, after only a few minutes use, shorted out internally and self discharge). Brand new battery, zero volts! I guess it's a good thing no ones life depended on that Duracell. When I replaced the bad Duracell battery, the little light worked fine (and has worked perfectly every day since, and runs a good six hours or more even on cheap AAA cells).

It would appear that the days of quality American products are gone. The good conservative 'family values' CE0's of American companies like to demonstrate their patriotism by shipping millions of American jobs overseas, and shipping in the cheapest possible low quality products, so the quality of 'American' brands like Duracell no longer seems to stand for much of anything.

Sorry for the rant.

 

[PocketBeam]

I agree, the strobe and SOS modes do not get in the way. Once you are used to the light, and you are not playing around, you will simply go straight to the mode you need and never pass Strobe or SOS mode. At first the strobe and SOS bugged me, but as I said now that I am used to the light and I have actually used it to do work, I never actually see those modes anymore. (Based on other Fenixes...)

I just got my L0D Q4 on Saturday. Actually I got two, one to give away. The box is nice, much smaller then I expected, well the light is small so what was I thinking? Both lights have the same color, which I and my unprompted wife both called copper orange. I like the color. I tested beam shots between the two L0D Q4's and they were almost 100% the same. There was a very minor beam difference int he hot spot that only a flashaholic would notice, and only when the beams are side by side. So I just randomly picked one to be mine.

The box comes with extra O ring, a split ring, and a pocket clip. I wasn't expecting the pocket clip, so that was a nice extra.

I compared the beam to my Arc body with a Lux III with a 10440 driven hard, and the L0D Q4 beat it in brightness. Not to mention the L0D Q4 has a impressive hotspot for a AAA sized light. I think it can throw to about 75 feet. Although that is a reach, but 50 feet is not too hard for it.

The mode switching is pretty easy and can be done one handed. it can be turned off with a small turn, although for security it takes a little bit more then a 1/4 turn to make sure pocket pressure won't turn it on. The anodizing is pretty hard as I was scratching it fairly hard trying to get the pocket clip on, but it didn't scratch. (Any secrets as I still don't have the clip on.)

This light is impressive at how bright it can be off a simple 1.2 volt battery. I tried a battery run down test, I used a eneloop AAA and in medium mode I got about three hours runtime. At about three hours the brightness dropped off significantly. But it never totally shut off, it kept doing a low moon mode for a long time. (I didn't time it.) I then shut it off and let the battery recover for a bit and when I turned it back on I got a bright light that lasted for a few minutes then went into the super low mode. I did this several times, and in all cases the light would always turn on and give at least some small amount of light. I felt I could count on this light.

This light is almost as bright as my L2D Rebel 100 on high (not turbo). I am very impressed and very happy with this light. It is bright enough I think I already get the wow factor without risking 10440's. I give this two thumbs up for flashaholic or non-flashaholics alike.

 

[Luminescent]

The anodizing is pretty hard as I was scratching it fairly hard trying to get the pocket clip on. (Any secrets as I still don't have the clip on.)

Glad you like your L0D-Q4! It's pretty hard not to like a light that packs such impressive performance into such a small package.

- Output that beats a 3 D-Cell Mag light and most LED lights six times it's size.

- Efficiency high enough to run hours in the lower output modes on a tiny AAA cell, then taper off into a virtually perfect moon mode with no unexpected cutoff.

Like Yoda said . . .

"Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you?"


Try this trick to get your pocket clip on without scratching anything.

Get a piece of thin hard plastic film like a piece of 'view graph' overhead transparency plastic. It needs to be about as thick and tough as the base plastic used for photographic film negatives.

cut a piece of this so that it perfectly matches the circumference of the light minus about a half millimeter, and so it's about an inch to an inch and a half wide, and wrap it around the light so it protects the area where the clip will rest, with at least a half inch sticking out past the end of the light. Now slide the clip up over the plastic and onto the light where it needs to be, then hold the clip in place and grab the plastic with a pair of pliers and pull it out from under the clip without letting the clip move.

The trick to getting this to work is to find a plastic material that is thin enough, tough enough, and slick enough not to bind as you pull it out from under the clip. That way the clip won't move and scratch the light as it settles down onto the surface of the light.

Edit:

Something I didn't get a chance to try yet, but which should work quite nicely is to leave the plastic under the clip to permanently protect the surface of the light.

We would still start with the idea of an oversized piece of plastic wrapped around the light with the edge generously overlapping the edge of the light, so the clip can be more easily slid up over the edge of the light and into place.

But to allow the plastic under the clip to remain, before we wrap the plastic around the light we score a line with an exacto knife almost through the plastic parallel to the edge that will overlap the body of the light and exactly the width of the clip from that edge. The idea is to create a scored line on the plastic that we can tear along later to create a strip matching the width of the part of the metal clip that wraps around the L0D. (again, this is done before we wrap the plastic around the L0D's body, so we don't risk nicking the light's body with the exacto knife by trying to trim the plastic after it's on the light)

Then the plastic is wrapped around the light with this scored line also wrapping around the light (scored side down) and with the scored line overlapped at least an eighth inch up onto the body of the light so it's not right at the tail edge of the light (to keep it from tearing prematurely as the clip is slid up over it).

Then after the clip is slid up onto the light just tug the plastic back until the scored line matches up with the outside edge of the clip and tear the plastic neatly around this outside edge of the clip so the narrow strip of plastic under the clip stays in place.

The advantage of this approach is that in addition to protecting the light when the clip is put on, the plastic remaining under the clip will protect it later if the clip needs to be slid back off.