Survival LED Flashlight Testing.

[Woods Walker]

I'm heading out to the nearest State Park after work tomorrow afternoon and I'll be taking lights set up with both the M61LL and the M61NLL. I'm anxious to compare them. Certainly the LL is brighter in subjective terms than the NLL, but I will have to see if the difference is pronounced in the woods. While I generally prefer neutral tints I can see why you favor the regular LL as a survival/backup light- it's a lot of lumens for the battery life with very good throw distance.

I am going to do the same thing next week but have another survival twist. Visibility of the host when left on the ground. I will also do a runtime test of the NLL compared to LL just to check something out using 2X16650 2500 mAh running (one for each) side by side however will post those results on the junky thread.

 

[Rob Babcock]

I am going to do the same thing next week but have another survival twist. Visibility of the host when left on the ground. I will also do a runtime test of the NLL compared to LL just to check something out using 2X16650 2500 mAh running (one for each) side by side however will post those results on the junky thread.

Great minds think alike!:laughing: I have my LL's set up in two Nitrolon hosts- one is a Yellow body with black tail and bezel, the other black body with yellow bezel. The contrast makes them easier to see and the different color combos allow me to tell the lights apart without turning them on. Plus I just dig the two tone look. What can I say? As a kid I would buy several pairs of canvas Converse shoes and wear two different colors every day.

 

[Woods Walker]

Great minds think alike!:laughing: I have my LL's set up in two Nitrolon hosts- one is a Yellow body with black tail and bezel, the other black body with yellow bezel. The contrast makes them easier to see and the different color combos allow me to tell the lights apart without turning them on. Plus I just dig the two tone look. What can I say? As a kid I would buy several pairs of canvas Converse shoes and wear two different colors every day.

Sure. We could do that. LOL!

 

[Rob Babcock]

I took my new M61NLL for a spin yesterday on overnighter in the nearest State Park. The one downside is that I didn't get the chance this time to compare the M61LL to the M61NLL head to head; sadly I didn't have enough hosts. As I alluded to earlier I took the yellow body with the black tailcap and the bezel off a 6P and set up with the M61N. I needed the metal head for the full-power dropin for cooling purposes, and as I got to setting up the other ones I discovered that one of the G2's I got from eBay seems to be a counterfeit. The tailcap isn't quite right and the molding of the body is a little dodgy. Moreover the parts aren't a suitable fit with the parts of known genuine models. Given the fact that I was in a hurry to meet my brother at the trailhead I didn't have time to dig through my stuff and play "musical hosts". So my comparisons of the two different LL's will to come from memory.

The cooler LL does have more power, that's for sure. But the tint of the NLL is really superb and a great match for bushcrafting. I had the M61N in one host and the M61NLL in another so I did some comparisons. There's always some variation between emitters in the same models and it would seem that the "N" won the "tint lottery" here. The color was slightly better than the NLL, but not by a lot. Up close the two were interchangeable for all intents and purposes. Of course the N has a lot higher output and is useful for illuminating objects much farther away.

I will say though that the cool/standard M61LL is a superb dropin as well. The NLL is more pleasing to my eye but as a survival light the LL could be a better choice in some circumstances. If I was planning on having several lights along (and let's be honest, I usually have at least three or four!) then the NLL would certainly be one of them. But if I only had one light to do everything...well, the higher output of the LL might make it a better choice since runtimes should be about the same.

 

[Woods Walker]

Bad knock off G2 problem going on right now. I only buy used ones from individuals and then only if it looks older and the person has the right profile aka he or she appears to be the owner. If you post a photo of the tail cap I can verify if it is a fake but odds are you know. Oddly some fake tail caps are really good in terms of working but seem cheaper. Then again there isn't much to go wrong with them though prefer real. Going to do the same test during my next outing but really concentrating on visibility of the host. OD and black vs bright yellow and bright orange.

 

[BugoutBoys]

I feel like the new SF Aviator is a great survival flashlight. Small. SF durability. Only needs a single CR123. 250 Surefire lumens. And has a high/low mode for color and white light. Plus TIR lens so you don't have a glass window that can break. Overall seems perfect to me. Good run times too

 

[TMedina]

Yeah, I've seen a proliferation of "G2 clones" popping up on Alibaba and elsewhere. Once SF discontinued the line, I guess they became fair game?

 

[RobertMM]

I feel like the new SF Aviator is a great survival flashlight. Small. SF durability. Only needs a single CR123. 250 Surefire lumens. And has a high/low mode for color and white light. Plus TIR lens so you don't have a glass window that can break. Overall seems perfect to me. Good run times too

The TIR lights still have coated and tempered glass above the optic.
Good point about the runtimes though. I want a YG version because of the runtimes.

 

[Rob Babcock]

It had never occurred to me that knocking off the old G2 Nitrolon could be such a big business. On eBay I now begin by filtering it down to just products located in the USA. That strips out the obvious fakes from China and the Russian Federation. With the bodies it seems the fake ones have sharper, less rounded molding (especially left of the 'S' and to the right of the 'e') and the tailcaps lack the various hallmarks of the real thing. Yeah, some are probably servicable but some are far enough out of spec for parts to not swap. Plus of course I don't want to support the theft of IP.

I got one outright fake and one where the tailcap wasn't correct/original. In the case of the latter the listing mentioned that it was a "clicky" but I assumed the seller just didn't understand how they worked. Turns out he did and the cap really was an aftermarket clicky- worse yet it was a reverse clicky, not a forward. Useless to me. The former came from a reputable selling and I expect they didn't know (lights isn't their primary product).

 

[Woods Walker]

Yeah, I've seen a proliferation of "G2 clones" popping up on Alibaba and elsewhere. Once SF discontinued the line, I guess they became fair game?

Probably not fair game IMHO but to eBay scammers everything is fair.

It had never occurred to me that knocking off the old G2 Nitrolon could be such a big business. On eBay I now begin by filtering it down to just products located in the USA. That strips out the obvious fakes from China and the Russian Federation. With the bodies it seems the fake ones have sharper, less rounded molding (especially left of the 'S' and to the right of the 'e') and the tailcaps lack the various hallmarks of the real thing. Yeah, some are probably servicable but some are far enough out of spec for parts to not swap. Plus of course I don't want to support the theft of IP.

I got one outright fake and one where the tailcap wasn't correct/original. In the case of the latter the listing mentioned that it was a "clicky" but I assumed the seller just didn't understand how they worked. Turns out he did and the cap really was an aftermarket clicky- worse yet it was a reverse clicky, not a forward. Useless to me. The former came from a reputable selling and I expect they didn't know (lights isn't their primary product).

I think without SF production and people probably not in a hurry to dump theirs it's an opportunity to sell something which is worth 6 bucks for 20ish. Some fakes even use cheap LED drop-ins and others actually have the incan. I purchased a few fake twisty tail caps for extras beyond my originals and yea they seem cheaper but actually work fantastic on everything I tried. I wouldn't use it for first line but for a backup twisty which works great with the MD2 it was a deal and purchased fully knowing it was fake. Don't think it was even marketed as original SF (unlike the fake G2s).

 

[eh4]

"But once you're in a bad spot a light isn't among the most useful things to have. Obviously it doesn't hurt but if you're in a situation where there's no chance of avoiding a night or two out then shelter is a much bigger deal. You need to control your core temp which requires at least one of three things (and probably several)- shelter, fire and water."

I agree, except that emergencies are often the result of a change of plans, or bad planning. Some preparations for shelter, fire, water, that might have been easy during daylight, could be well near impossible in the dark.
A little bit of light goes a long ways in dealing with blinding darkness, whether that's pitch dark or a late rising, waning moon, or older eyes.
I think that by the time you're talking about very many ounces of light source, we might be into personal taste, or special purposes, but an ounce or four of reliable lighting can be worth the weight of any other piece of "survival gear ", especially if it means walking out in a couple hours instead of hunkering down for the night unnecessarily.

 

[Rob Babcock]

"But once you're in a bad spot a light isn't among the most useful things to have. Obviously it doesn't hurt but if you're in a situation where there's no chance of avoiding a night or two out then shelter is a much bigger deal. You need to control your core temp which requires at least one of three things (and probably several)- shelter, fire and water."

I agree, except that emergencies are often the result of a change of plans, or bad planning. Some preparations for shelter, fire, water, that might have been easy during daylight, could be well near impossible in the dark.
A little bit of light goes a long ways in dealing with blinding darkness, whether that's pitch dark or a late rising, waning moon, or older eyes.
I think that by the time you're talking about very many ounces of light source, we might be into personal taste, or special purposes, but an ounce or four of reliable lighting can be worth the weight of any other piece of "survival gear ", especially if it means walking out in a couple hours instead of hunkering down for the night unnecessarily.

I don't disagree with you so much as in definitions. When I'm in the woods I have gear that I always carry then I have survival gear. To me they're different pools; the EDC gear is used continually while I'm out and the survival gear is not used except to train with (then replaced or returned to readiness). Depending on the location where I'm hiking and what I'm otherwise carrying my survival gear may or may not contain a light. My smallest kits often won't have one since it's not strictly a survival item to me, plus I know I will generally have several lights already on me.

Let me also clarify that I don't base what I carry on how long I plan to be out. Obviously you can get lost on a hike just as easily as on an extended expedition. I do base my gear on how remote the location is though, and the likely conditions I will encounter. For example if I'm in boreal forests in the lower 48 in July I can reasonably assume that temps won't be -20 F. Likewise what I take for water will depend on where I'm going.

 

[Woods Walker]

Another consideration is foraging. It's easier to get certain prey items at night. Frogs and crayfish come to mind.



These dandelions and violets not so much.

 

[BugoutBoys]

Thinking more on the importance of a flashlight in a survival situation got me thinking of my own demographic. I live in Virginia so the summers are not only very hot but very humid as well. When hiking through the woods, especially with a pack, you start sweating very fast. That obviously introduced the issue of needing more water to drink because the more you sweat, the more you need to replenish. At night, the temp goes to a very comfortable range for movement. So this in my mind greatly increases the value of a good flashlight by your side. During the day should be spent plotting routes on a map, or gathering food or water. At night is when you should be moving, which requires the ability to see. By "good" flashlight I don't mean the brightest. My current EDC is the Surefire Aviator (2017 version) and it's great because it has the colored option. Mine is blue at 0.4 lumens low or 4 lumens high. Those are both great for moving around at night without drawing too much attention to myself. And if I do need more light, I can just rotate the bezel and have a high/low mode of white light.
This along with some Nitecores that have the 1 lumen low mode would be great. Traveling at night would reduce visibility to potential threats, as well as reduced exposure to water loss due to sweating in the intense heat while exerting yourself.

 

[marinemaster]

Its called moonlight like in light from the moon. Our ancestors used for like what 4,000,000 years or so, or somewhere in there. [emoji41]

 

[TMedina]

Although most of the hypothetical predators would be far better at night hunting than early humans would have been at evading them.

 

[Woods Walker]

Hurricane Harvey has shown that sometimes nature comes to you and the kit you can grab and GO with might be all yea got. In these rare but devastating cases reliability of a survival light is key but also a picky eater isn't exactly what I would want. So we are testing the DIY omnivore/kit light again. I have made 3 of these in different configurations. Will do a thread and video on that in the near future. A low voltage omnivore 1 to 4.2 volts IMHO is more practical for a situation like natural disaster as they can run of a single battery. No need to match battery types and voltages. Repeated testing can uncover issues which might not appear if the gear is tested once then tossed in a BOB or other preps.


Low voltage omnivore testing go! This is 3.3 volts max which means no lithium ion however given the reliability of the Surefire G3 host and Malkoff M31L I am willing to live with that limitation for this particular application.

I can run:


2XAAA
1XAAA
2XAA
1XAA
1XCR123


But can I?

The cheap Ultra Cell spacer failed. I mean really! LOL! Didn't think there was anything to go wrong. I purchased 4 so replaced it and headed out. This issue will be addressed later.

Got 7.4 mile on foot with plenty of light from 1XAA. Time to head back out again using the same 1XAA battery.

As this has an urban/rural twist we will be using dirt roads and streets.

Which aren't always safe. I am backpack jogging so gotta watch for stuff like this.

Still plenty of light from 1XAA.





We got over 8 miles this time.

For the two days I did 16 miles at night. Still had power but was getting dimmer. The voltage is....

Not dead but not full either. Time to address that dead battery spacer issue.

The black spacer is new and feels more robust than the Ultra Cell. Also the contacts seem more forgiving as they're wider though need to test them with 1XAAA. Both ends are identical.

Lets take it for a test run.

6 miles later.

Bottom line was despite having a fairly expensive light system (G3/M31L) most of the utility was removed because of a cheap part failure. I think if the new black spacers pass all the tests will keep an Ultra Cell and black AA spacer in the kits rather than just one. This does bring the obvious question. Why not pack an extra battery in it's place? Hypothetically the spacers aren't consumable (when they don't fail LOL!) and batteries are. So I will also pack batteries however the spacers are always there if needed.

 

[jon_slider]

Woods Walker][/COLOR]I can run... 16 miles at night.

how many hours (3?), how many lumens(40?)

 

[Woods Walker]

how many hours (3?), how many lumens(40?)

4.5 mpr so maybe a bit more. I also think the lumen output was more than 40 but not more than say 50 however can't be sure.

 

[Woods Walker]

Survival/ER prep low voltage omnivore lights.

4/7s lego. Low voltage tactical head and tactical tail cap on Turbo 2XAA body with extra 1XCR123 body.

The spacer works great on all the lights except the 4/7 so will use the Ultra Cells for now but double up.

The physical polarity protection might be the reason.