Modern. 380 rounds vs 9mm

[raggie33]

Never fired a flat triger before seems like it wouldnt be good

 

[orbital]

Never fired a flat triger before seems like it wouldnt be good

+

Have one on my Canik METE Pro 5"
amazingly comfortable, predictable, huge selling point in my opinion.

Wasn't sure at first, then after one magazine, wish all my triggers were flat

 

[raggie33]

Canik has the best triger there is the new mc9 prime is crazy good

 

[jacobd]

Never fired a flat triger before seems like it wouldnt be good

Flat triggers have much more control and feedback in my opinion. My preference by a LONG way

 

[xxo]

I believe he's a well practiced marksman. Didn't watch.

Still don't see .380 filling the role of my primary. Absolutely nothing wrong, with that conclusion.

Discreet defense research tests a lot of .380 rounds. Including Underwood, etc. If you're interested.

380 does surprisingly well in real world defensive shootings:



Statistically, there's not much difference between a 380 and more powerful handgun rounds, such as 38 special, 9 MM, 357, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP.

 

[raggie33]

Id be willing to bet in cases where more thrn rounds must be used to elimanate danger a 380 is more efective due to thr abilty to control muzzl3 rise and flip

 

[raggie33]

Win a bodyguard 2.0 comp

https://swee.ps/EBSQaY_uaQHmBn

 

[Monocrom]

If a person can handle the recoil from a sub-compact carry-pistol in making fast follow-up shots (if needed), then no reason to go with a .380 ACP.

 

[raggie33]

I can handle all r3coil with excemption of the 500 that gun is justvstupid in a hand gun lol

 

[Poppy]

380 does surprisingly well in real world defensive shootings:



Statistically, there's not much difference between a 380 and more powerful handgun rounds, such as 38 special, 9 MM, 357, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP.

@xxo It's been years since I looked at one shot stops statistics, but If I recall correctly there was a significant difference among the various calibers.
The .380 and the 38 special each performed at about 58% one shot stops
I never saw stats for the 40 S&W
The 357 performed the best at 95%
I don't recall the stats of the 45 ACP, but it was certainly above the .380 and the 38 special.

Regarding recoil and ability to control, my little Colt 380 mustang is more challenging to control due to the small two finger purchase of the grip, compared to that of my full size 9mm sig. The colt is much easier to conceal than any other.

 

[raggie33]

@xxo It's been years since I looked at one shot stops statistics, but If I recall correctly there was a significant difference among the various calibers.
The .380 and the 38 special each performed at about 58% one shot stops
I never saw stats for the 40 S&W
The 357 performed the best at 95%
I don't recall the stats of the 45 ACP, but it was certainly above the .380 and the 38 special.

Regarding recoil and ability to control, my little Colt 380 mustang is more challenging to control due to the small two finger purchase of the grip, compared to that of my full size 9mm sig. The colt is much easier to conceal than any other.

When i handled the 380 body guard 2.0 at store even with 10 rpund clip all my fingers fit on handle. Not bad for a gun that weighs less then 10 ounces

 

[orbital]

If a person can handle the recoil from a sub-compact carry-pistol in making fast follow-up shots (if needed), then no reason to go with a .380 ACP.

+

It's all about how a pistol size handles any given round
meaning, matching barrel length to weight of gunpowder used (and bullet weight)

If you had a 2.2" barrel using a 10mm round, there'd be issues, fundamental issues

btw:: no reason .380 ammo should be as expensive as it is

 

[orbital]

+

Giving this it's own post# regarding follow-up shots

If you can answer to yourself what causes alot of kick in a pistol, you've then answered the most important questions



I'v shot a 1911* in .45 that had less kick than a 9mm**

* 5" barrel
** 4" barrel

 

[dc38]

When i handled the 380 body guard 2.0 at store even with 10 rpund clip all my fingers fit on handle. Not bad for a gun that weighs less then 10 ounces

It's good that people figured out that a full sized trigger guard on a concealed carry is kinda dumb...it's the BODYGUARD, not the hitman.

**the guard on the original bodyguard eats up alot of grip real estate.

 

[xxo]

If a person can handle the recoil from a sub-compact carry-pistol in making fast follow-up shots (if needed), then no reason to go with a .380 ACP.

Sure there is. A Bodyguard 2.0 or LCP Max are about half the weight and considerably less bulky/easier to conceal than a "micro" 9 like the Shield Plus.

Still, if you can handle a little more recoil and can conceal a micro 9, it is a step up from a 380 ballisticaly (though at least some of the statistics show that this does not make a huge difference in real world defensive shootings).

I think the best advice I have heard is - carry what you like best, can conceal on a every day basis, shoot well, has proven safe, reliable and accurate.....pretty much any caliber from 380 on up will do......just do some research and pick your ammunition wisely.

 

[xxo]

@xxo It's been years since I looked at one shot stops statistics, but If I recall correctly there was a significant difference among the various calibers.
The .380 and the 38 special each performed at about 58% one shot stops
I never saw stats for the 40 S&W
The 357 performed the best at 95%
I don't recall the stats of the 45 ACP, but it was certainly above the .380 and the 38 special.

Regarding recoil and ability to control, my little Colt 380 mustang is more challenging to control due to the small two finger purchase of the grip, compared to that of my full size 9mm sig. The colt is much easier to conceal than any other.

Evan Marshall did a lot of good work with one shot stops of specific handgun loads back in the 80's and 90's. I think he was on the right track, but newer statistics looking a failure rates by caliber give a little different perspective:



The current prevailing view among most law enforcement agencies is that calibers such as 45, 40 and 357 SIG are no more effective than the current best performing 9 mm loads. Personally, I am of the opinion that the best loads in 45 and 40 are still a little more effective than the best 9 mm loads, but today the difference is nowhere near as big as it was back in the 90's.

The main reason law enforcement agencies are going back to 9's is primarily due to shootability/accuracy as reflected in qualification scores. More rounds in the magazine and lower cost ammo are bonuses.


It is true that 380's tend to have small grips and can be harder to shoot that bigger guns, but it is not always the case. I find that the BG 2.0 gives me a better/full fingered grip than the larger shield plus 9. S&W did a better job on the ergonomics on the BG 2.0 grip, though the Shield Plus does have a thicker grip which is good along with a slightly longer sight radius and much better sights. The BG 2.0 has the advantage of lower recoil and a much lower bore axis. I suppose I can shoot the shield a little better, but only with the extended 13 and 15 round mags.

 

[raggie33]

Im small so my hands are small the 380 fit my hand well may pick one up. Or the sig 365 or hellcat or canik the ammo cost of 380 sucks uti think it will come down

 

[xxo]

Im small so my hands are small the 380 fit my hand well may pick one up. Or the sig 365 or hellcat or canik the ammo cost of 380 sucks uti think it will come down

I think the BG 2.0 has a lot going for it based on it's design but S&W's still got some bugs to work out. Some (most?) seem to run fine except for the sights are almost always off to the left as the come form the factory and the last round or two are near impossible to load into the magazines without a mag loader.

Some (too many) have reliability issues such as failure to feed (the two piece feed ramp might not have been the greatest idea), stove pipe jams where the round from the mag feeds into the chamber but the previous round's fired case does not eject and gets caught in the slide and faulty recoil spring assemblies that can lock up the gun.

I personally wouldn't get a p365 (too many reports of problems), don't know about the hellcat or the canicks. Glocks are always a good bet for reliability, though I don't much like Glocks grip, sights or triggers. The S&W Shield Plus is just as reliable as Glock, but I like the Grips, sights and trigger better, bigger heavier pistol than the bodyguard 2.0, but it's a 9 so range ammo is cheaper.

 

[SCEMan]

380 does surprisingly well in real world defensive shootings:



Statistically, there's not much difference between a 380 and more powerful handgun rounds, such as 38 special, 9 MM, 357, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP.

I stopped watching at: 32 ACP at 72% one stop shot effectiveness vs. 45 ACP (51%) and 44 Mag (53%)...
Too bad Alvin York had a 1911 .45 and not a .32 Auto in the Argonne Forest.

 

[xxo]

I stopped watching at: 32 ACP at 72% one stop shot effectiveness vs. 45 ACP (51%) and 44 Mag (53%)...
Too bad Alvin York had a 1911 .45 and not a .32 Auto in the Argonne Forest.

here's why:



later in the vid it shows that 32 acp has a 40% failure rate, more than double the larger calibers.