Battery exploded in flashlight
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Lunarmodule
Enlightened
a99raptors said:
Good guess. In the exploding Pelican M6 thread, the prime suspect for the detonating cell(s) were indeed Surefire 123s, with the distinctive red wrapper. Another CPF thread reported rupturing primary Cr123s in a Surefire M6 while stored in a vehicle in extreme cold. Brand? Surefire. In each thread were several mentions of other Surefire batteries involved in little disasters. Kind puts a new twist on the company's play on words name. Surefire: you can be sure of one thing, this babys gonna FIRE* (*=we didnt say one kind or another)
Its kind of irritating to hear reports of folks regarding their lithium batteries as "little bombs" and nonsense like that. Automobiles are killing machines like no other, with incomprehesibly terrible murderous potential cleverly concealed with mile after trouble free mile of normal driving. If everybody contemplated nothing BUT how head on collisions are supposed to be like at 75mph, how many folks could still keep their wits about them in a parking lot at those parking lot speeds? Simple: folks would scare themselves into NOT driving? Why risk it? Life's too precious. It certainly is. To waste time cowering in fear over flashlight batteries, it is indeed. Now, for the schmoe with his 15 Amp Magmod 3D with magnets between his CPB1650 cells, be afraid, be very afraid. Your express ticket to Short CIrcuit CIty is waiting for you, sir. But especially single cell applications, 123s of ANY manufacture. I worry much more about being spontaneously mawled by escaped Persian Tigers from the local zoo.
I distinctly remember someone wisecracking about my portable hand grenade, referring to my home grown rechargeable LiIon battery pack I made for my Surefire M6. I used unprotected cells in a pack configuration, and it was likened by one to be akin to said grenade. Be sure to update your progress if you still have both hands in a few weeks..... I shake my head and remember that one.
NewBie
*Retired*
You know, it is *quite* ignorant for folks to be discounting the dangers of Lithium cells...in the extreme.
We see examples quite often, of them causing things to project, that could easily put out a child's eye, or get hot and disfigure/leave scares. That Lithium 123 cell M6 flashlight tailcap launched so hard, that it nearly went through a solid oak cabinet door!
The thread is found here, make sure to follow the thread to the end, you will see additional pictures later in the thread:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=78843
Here is another example of these Primary Lithium 123 cells (Battery Station) misbehaving, luckily this one didn't fail so badly:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91245
And it is not always when you abuse the cells, occassionally they just blow up.
We are constantly getting new members, and it is important for them to understand the dangers and risks.
It is really stupid to the extreme, to think there are no dangers. We have seen multiple examples of 123 cells causing dangerous failures right here on cpf, and we are a very small cross-section of only ~20,000 users.
Once one is aware of the dangers of Lithium batteries, and how to treat them properly, not to mix brands, or *NOT* putting in a fresh 123 for one of the two that was dead- to save money, *NOT* running them down until the filament doesn't glow at all, *NOT* letting them bake in the sun in a flat black finish flashlight on a dashboard, *NOT* trying to recharge them, *NOT* trying to recharge them, *NOT* using cells that have a dent, and many other situations, then a person can make a *WISE* informed choice, and also be aware of the dangers and how to treat Lithium cells accordingly.
I am very surprised that the majority flashlight manufacturers have not added circuitry to shut down a 123 cell flashlight when the cells drop below a given voltage. This would help eliminate one of the possible failure modes that can lead to venting, venting with flame, expulsion of internals, projectile launching of internals, or explosion. A safety venting mechanism in sealed flashlights might also be very useful in these situations, allowing a Lithium 123 cell flashlight to contain some of the failure modes, resulting in less danger/risk to the end user.
To give you just one example of the many safety bulletin/recalls dealing with 123 cells:
Name of product: Fuji Power and A&T Fuji Power
CR123A 3-volt lithium batteries originally provided with Galls® H.A.L.O. Tactical Flashlight.
Hazard: The batteries originally provided with the flashlight may overheat or explode presenting a potential for fire or personal injury.
Incidents/Injuries: Five reports of batteries overheating or exploding have been received, causing minor injuries such as burns and minor
property damage from fire.
http://list.uvm.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0309d&L=safety&D=1&P=9889
And there are *PLENTY* of these type of safety/recall notices out there.
Just knowing that 123 Primary Lithium cells are in fact a risk, and understanding how to treat them properly to minimize that risk is very important.
We see examples quite often, of them causing things to project, that could easily put out a child's eye, or get hot and disfigure/leave scares. That Lithium 123 cell M6 flashlight tailcap launched so hard, that it nearly went through a solid oak cabinet door!
The thread is found here, make sure to follow the thread to the end, you will see additional pictures later in the thread:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=78843
Here is another example of these Primary Lithium 123 cells (Battery Station) misbehaving, luckily this one didn't fail so badly:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91245
And it is not always when you abuse the cells, occassionally they just blow up.
We are constantly getting new members, and it is important for them to understand the dangers and risks.
It is really stupid to the extreme, to think there are no dangers. We have seen multiple examples of 123 cells causing dangerous failures right here on cpf, and we are a very small cross-section of only ~20,000 users.
Once one is aware of the dangers of Lithium batteries, and how to treat them properly, not to mix brands, or *NOT* putting in a fresh 123 for one of the two that was dead- to save money, *NOT* running them down until the filament doesn't glow at all, *NOT* letting them bake in the sun in a flat black finish flashlight on a dashboard, *NOT* trying to recharge them, *NOT* trying to recharge them, *NOT* using cells that have a dent, and many other situations, then a person can make a *WISE* informed choice, and also be aware of the dangers and how to treat Lithium cells accordingly.
I am very surprised that the majority flashlight manufacturers have not added circuitry to shut down a 123 cell flashlight when the cells drop below a given voltage. This would help eliminate one of the possible failure modes that can lead to venting, venting with flame, expulsion of internals, projectile launching of internals, or explosion. A safety venting mechanism in sealed flashlights might also be very useful in these situations, allowing a Lithium 123 cell flashlight to contain some of the failure modes, resulting in less danger/risk to the end user.
To give you just one example of the many safety bulletin/recalls dealing with 123 cells:
Name of product: Fuji Power and A&T Fuji Power
CR123A 3-volt lithium batteries originally provided with Galls® H.A.L.O. Tactical Flashlight.
Hazard: The batteries originally provided with the flashlight may overheat or explode presenting a potential for fire or personal injury.
Incidents/Injuries: Five reports of batteries overheating or exploding have been received, causing minor injuries such as burns and minor
property damage from fire.
http://list.uvm.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0309d&L=safety&D=1&P=9889
And there are *PLENTY* of these type of safety/recall notices out there.
Just knowing that 123 Primary Lithium cells are in fact a risk, and understanding how to treat them properly to minimize that risk is very important.
Illum
Flashaholic
Thanks alot NewBie :sick2:
Im really scared now....
-Two boxes of 12 "bombs" are currently sitting infront of me in their red Surefire Boxes.
-Fireworks from the previous 0704 in a bag on the shelf behind me. WD-40 on adjoining working bench, and a couple butane cans for lighter refill...
My inova XO with its two 123As tucked under my pillow... and the nearest fire extinguisher is behind three doors and in the garage
What are the risks in percentage that a new cr123A stored in ambient room temperature explode into fire and glory at my expense?
Im really scared now....
-Two boxes of 12 "bombs" are currently sitting infront of me in their red Surefire Boxes.
-Fireworks from the previous 0704 in a bag on the shelf behind me. WD-40 on adjoining working bench, and a couple butane cans for lighter refill...
My inova XO with its two 123As tucked under my pillow... and the nearest fire extinguisher is behind three doors and in the garage
What are the risks in percentage that a new cr123A stored in ambient room temperature explode into fire and glory at my expense?
NewBie
*Retired*
Illum_the_nation said:
The risks? I don't believe I'm qualified to say.
Don't be scared, just treat them with the respect they really do deserve.
Give me good old fashioned AA alkies anytime.
The expense isn't worth it
The extra bit of brightness/runtime isn't worth it.
I'll take a dead flashlight from a battery leak everytime. You can throw a rock and basically hit somewhere where there is a AA or two running about and/or being sold. If you're going to the boonies; plan ahead.
Keep the lights in your car checked from time to time.
If you were to burn down your house because of one of these, I can pretty much guarantee the wife is gonna put an end to your flashaholism - full stop.
I'm sure you could try to rationalize that a new flashlight you got only runs on alkalines much like the TV remote does. I'm also pretty sure that that rational would fall on deaf ears. All that would compute to them is: flashlight=destroyed home.
Probably best to store those things in some kind of fire safe or even an army surplus ammo can to minimize any damage if you use flashlights that take them.
I'll stick to inexpensive AA/D's myself.
The expense isn't worth it
The extra bit of brightness/runtime isn't worth it.
I'll take a dead flashlight from a battery leak everytime. You can throw a rock and basically hit somewhere where there is a AA or two running about and/or being sold. If you're going to the boonies; plan ahead.
Keep the lights in your car checked from time to time.
If you were to burn down your house because of one of these, I can pretty much guarantee the wife is gonna put an end to your flashaholism - full stop.
I'm sure you could try to rationalize that a new flashlight you got only runs on alkalines much like the TV remote does. I'm also pretty sure that that rational would fall on deaf ears. All that would compute to them is: flashlight=destroyed home.
Probably best to store those things in some kind of fire safe or even an army surplus ammo can to minimize any damage if you use flashlights that take them.
I'll stick to inexpensive AA/D's myself.
benighted
Enlightened
I experienced the same thing after I made a flashlight out of a MR16 track light by soldering 4 123A's in series and adding a switch.
I had it sitting in the backseat of my car when I heard a loud "pop" and then a pungent lithium odor (smells like a hot lithium battery only much stronger). I don't know why it exploded but it may have shorted out somehow
I had it sitting in the backseat of my car when I heard a loud "pop" and then a pungent lithium odor (smells like a hot lithium battery only much stronger). I don't know why it exploded but it may have shorted out somehow
Knight Lights
Enlightened
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2006
- Messages
- 215
benighted,
NEVER solder Lithum cells. That is a major NO-NO!!
In fact, soldering Li cells is asking for trouble.
Bill
NEVER solder Lithum cells. That is a major NO-NO!!
In fact, soldering Li cells is asking for trouble.
Bill
batterystation
Enlightened
I am not sure how to say more than Newbie and others have already said except this:
Exploding batteries is NOT, I repeat NOT a brand of battery issue. They are ALL unsafe in certain yet to be completely understood conditions. There is a lot of common sense things to keep in mind like NOT mixing batteries, etc.
There appear to be freaky things that happen. Our goal is to attempt to figure a lot of this out but the bottom line seems to be "BE CAREFUL."
Alkaline batteries can produce hydrogen gas as well and have caused flashlight bodies to also explode, so again apply common sense and just beware that you are dealing with stored energy. Stored energy can get unstored pretty fast at times.
Exploding batteries is NOT, I repeat NOT a brand of battery issue. They are ALL unsafe in certain yet to be completely understood conditions. There is a lot of common sense things to keep in mind like NOT mixing batteries, etc.
There appear to be freaky things that happen. Our goal is to attempt to figure a lot of this out but the bottom line seems to be "BE CAREFUL."
Alkaline batteries can produce hydrogen gas as well and have caused flashlight bodies to also explode, so again apply common sense and just beware that you are dealing with stored energy. Stored energy can get unstored pretty fast at times.
benighted
Enlightened
Thanks for the warning Bill I read this somewhere on the forums but I figured since I was already done with the soldering the danger was in the past but I guess the heat can do unseen damage to the batteries and cause them pop.Knight Lights said:
But I'm still not sure if the exploded battery was caused by heat damage or a short, the wiring was a bit sloppy so it could have been either.
bwaites
Flashlight Enthusiast
Soldering a Lithium cell can close the vents that are necessary for safe function.
Multiple factors then come into play.
Bill
Multiple factors then come into play.
Bill
batterystation
Enlightened
It would seem that single cell lights are the safest because most are LED and they eliminate the "mixed cell" added hazard. I believe SFs now to be Energizers.
Warp
Enlightened
After reading all of these recent events I changed where I store my lithium batteries! Until a few days ago I kept them in the same drawer as approximately 200 rounds of ammo for handgun. 
All lithiums are now safely removed from ammo in their own otter box.
All lithiums are now safely removed from ammo in their own otter box.
FlashlightOCD
Enlightened
I completely forgot that I kept a black FireFly in my car for emergency. Only one cell, but in the Florida sun with no shade and black car interior I suspect it might be thermally stressing the cell a bit. Especially after exposure for an entire summer last year. I removed the light and changed the cell out "Just in Case".
Not trying to scare anyone, I'm just suggest thinking about things like that and use common sense. I've been through literally hundreds of CR123's with only minor malfunctions [a few of the cells "silently" dying prematurely]. I will continue to use my SF M6 and other multi-cell 123's, just think I might consider thermal strain on the batteries a little more carefully now.
Someone in another thread mentioned rotating cells [front to back] in high power multi-cell lights, reasoning that thermal difference might drain batteries at different rates. That made sense to me. Any of the battery experts buy into that theory?
Not trying to scare anyone, I'm just suggest thinking about things like that and use common sense. I've been through literally hundreds of CR123's with only minor malfunctions [a few of the cells "silently" dying prematurely]. I will continue to use my SF M6 and other multi-cell 123's, just think I might consider thermal strain on the batteries a little more carefully now.
Someone in another thread mentioned rotating cells [front to back] in high power multi-cell lights, reasoning that thermal difference might drain batteries at different rates. That made sense to me. Any of the battery experts buy into that theory?
From Energizer's Product Safety Data Sheet for Lithium-Manganese Dioxide batteries:
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/lithiummangdioxide_psds.pdf
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/lithiummangdioxide_psds.pdf
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mdocod
Flashaholic
eeeeek! i'm kinda looking around me at the moment... realizing that I am surrounded by little bombs... i think i'm going to try to find a safe container for these suckers...
mdocod
Flashaholic
on a side note- anyone else find it slightly humorous that titanium cells from amondotech have "POWPOWER" in bold letters on the side? what are they trying to tell us?
tvodrd
*Flashaholic* ,
FlashlightOCD said:
Don did some experiments along those lines here. Basically it seems that more watt-hours are available from a cell operated at elevated temperatures. I *think* a 123's internal resistance decreases as its temperature rises.
The phenominon(sp) of a significant shelf/standby life reduction after using some percentage of a lith primary's capacity is also poorly understood, at least by me. I picked up my SF Beast recently and it wouldn't light. I dumped the (20!) SF123s and every one of them was completely dead, as in 0V! No leakers or other "issues." That light isn't easy to turn on by accident, and I doubt I set it muzzle-down on the floor behind this chair with it on!!! We have a lot to learn.
Larry
