Malkoff Runtime Graphs - CR123/Alkaline Comparo

[tech25]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Thanks. I assume that's because of the decreased drain on the three vs two batteries?

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Higher voltage = lower drain per cell.

You are always better off with multiple cells. Such as 2 18650 or even 3x18650 versus 1

 

[INFRNL]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

ETC's Special request

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

For your graphs do you use the first gen M61T, or the second gen?

Bill

 

[INFRNL]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

For your graphs do you use the first gen M61T, or the second gen?

Bill

It must be second gen since I just got it recently. All of my lights are from either last year or this year. I do have an older Hound Dog XM-L but i do not believe I have tested it yet. i also have some M60, M60F modules but haven't tested those yet either

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Thanks, I have the first gen. Seems to run a long time with one 18650. I will do a runtime using bounce and my light meter.

Bill

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Thank you.

I realize you have some other tests going on right now so I made a minor mod, superimposing MD3 and MD4 Hound Dog charts onto the above. It's not as precise but pretty close enough to get an idea. The character of the graphs made it very easy, as they flatline until they walk off the cliff. You are of course welcome to make the "real" graph when you get a few minutes, if that is at all possible.

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

For your graphs do you use the first gen M61T, or the second gen?

Bill

What exactly is the difference between 1st gen and 2 gen of M61T?

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Here is an interesting observation about HD MD4 versus M91T MD4.
The former has the area of the graph that's equal to 500 units (I just multiplied height * length) while the latter came out to 455.

The unit is irrelevant but in terms of efficiency, MD4 M91T is very slightly behind MD4 Hound Dog XML. The lumens are lower but the runtime is longer. Therefore the total amount of light is very close.

MD4 M91T is more efficient than MD3 Hound Dog (which is not efficient period - versus anything).

Hound Dog 18650 is almost as efficient as MD4 XML Hound Dog. Yeah, the lumens are lower and slightly more than 1/2 the lumens of MD4. And there is a curve involved. Yet the 18650 keeps going on after the MD4 walks off the cliff. I wouldn't say 18650 Hound Dog is "better" than MD4 Hound Dog or vice-versa but it's working very well given the parameters given - that is one cell versus 2.

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

And here we add M61T MD4 to the above superimposition. It's not perfectly precise but "close enough" to get an idea of one runtime versus another.
Again it's just a quick fix until sometime in the future we can have a "real" graph put together with all of these.

 

[INFRNL]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Thanks, I have the first gen. Seems to run a long time with one 18650. I will do a runtime using bounce and my light meter.

Bill

So, does the 1st gen use m60 rather than m61? If so, it seems that Gene needs to have a mutation of the 2. I keep hearing how m60/m30 does better than m61/m31 but the current modules have better tint and beam profile

 

[INFRNL]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

And here we add M61T MD4 to the above superimposition. It's not perfectly precise but "close enough" to get an idea of one runtime versus another.
Again it's just a quick fix until sometime in the future we can have a "real" graph put together with all of these.

So you want this

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

So, does the 1st gen use m60 rather than m61? If so, it seems that Gene needs to have a mutation of the 2. I keep hearing how m60/m30 does better than m61/m31 but the current modules have better tint and beam profile

I believe that the first gene M61T used the XP-E2 for about 250 lumens.

Bill

 

[INFRNL]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

I think I have officially linked all graphs that I have completed. I could be missing some, but i think I got them all.
Now time to work on more tests, look for ways to simplify things and possibly work on my other spreadsheet to show current draw. I might also make a simplified spreadsheet similar to not regulated's showing rated specs for each module/light. Will figure that out when i get motivated enough to start all of that.

 

[INFRNL]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Here is a request from Archi...which would have eventually been done anyway
M61WLL MD1/MD2 Rayovac

 

[archimedes]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Awesome, thanks ... that is super helpful :thumbsup:

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Here is a request from Archi...which would have eventually been done anyway
M61WLL MD1/MD2 Rayovac

Interesting... wow.

Reaffirms what I already suspected. the more cells in the series, the more efficient the device is. I knew it wouldn't be great but didn't know how bad it would be. So with 3V, it walks off the cliff in the first 5 minutes and then stays at 10 lumens for essentially forever or 24 hours, whichever comes first.

Just to add something interesting, has there been a chart of M61WLL on 2xAA? If my estimate is correct, 2xAA has the same voltage but greater capacity than 1x123, thus same lumens but even longer runtime. Theoretically.

Another special request: I am scanning the first page, I do not see any M61LL or M61LLL on 2xAA or 3xAA (would be interesting to see both in both configurations. Say 2xAA Alkalines and 3xAA Alkalines and 3xAA NiMH, 2xAA NiMH doesn't make sense I think.
Especially M61LLL (219 or not) on 3xAA.

2 is > 1
3> 2
and of course 4>3

 

[KBobAries]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

There's some great data in this thread and I think it's likely to help Malkoff's sales. INFRNL, thanks for being so generous with your time and resources to put it all together. May I request a test of an M61N (or M61 if a neutral variant is unavailable) in 2 x 18650 format? No rush; I'm sure there are many tests/requests in the queue ahead of me.

Thanks,

Dan

 

[etc]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Plus one to the above.

 

[Woods Walker]

Re: Malkoff Runtime Graphs - Ongoing Adventure

Interesting... wow.

Reaffirms what I already suspected. the more cells in the series, the more efficient the device is. I knew it wouldn't be great but didn't know how bad it would be. So with 3V, it walks off the cliff in the first 5 minutes and then stays at 10 lumens for essentially forever or 24 hours, whichever comes first.

Just to add something interesting, has there been a chart of M61WLL on 2xAA? If my estimate is correct, 2xAA has the same voltage but greater capacity than 1x123, thus same lumens but even longer runtime. Theoretically.

Another special request: I am scanning the first page, I do not see any M61LL or M61LLL on 2xAA or 3xAA (would be interesting to see both in both configurations. Say 2xAA Alkalines and 3xAA Alkalines and 3xAA NiMH, 2xAA NiMH doesn't make sense I think.
Especially M61LLL (219 or not) on 3xAA.

2 is > 1
3> 2
and of course 4>3

I remember similar preference results when using 1X16650 vs 2xCR123 for the M61s. They also didn't like 1XCR123. I think it's voltage not just capacity. 3 volts is just too low but 3.7 nominal volts... 4.2 off the charger was ok. That might also explain why Alky runs sooo much longer in a M31. This might also explain why 4 X AA runs like 3XCR123 which runs like 2x lithium ion in terms of output however 2X18650 runs longer. There is a threadhold in terms of voltage. Below that it just dies.